JOURNALIST: Herr Hübner, could we say that your musical commitment to nature has gone through different phases?

PETER HÜBNER: Yes, you could say that. In the beginning, there were harmonical compositions, which, in their structure, followed those laws of harmony that also find their expression in the work of the classical composers.

Then, following my registration at the music academy in Cologne, and there being clearly influenced by the universally dominating expert opinion that the classical music of the great tone creators would find its logical development in the atonal music of the “International avant-garde”, it took the shape of sharp and dissonant musical social criticism.

In one of my first musical pieces of work for the stage, in “Curse or blessing: Yet”, I gave very serious thought to the natural, individual, social and ecological possibilities for development, and particularly to the obstacles that stand in the way of a free and natural development.^Ernst And there a dissonant shape matches the musical description of such a disharmonious world view.

JOURNALIST: Perhaps it is safest if we open up your revo­lu­tion­ary mu­si­cal path from dis­so­nant so­cial criti­cism to mu­si­cal har­mony with the laws of na­ture through your first great piece for the stage “Curse or bless­ing: Yet”, in which, from the point of view of con­tent, you con­cern your­self “with God and the world”.^Grillparzer

PETER HÜBNER: Yes, Kchatom, the main character of the “opera” regards the misery he sees all over the world as the work of the devil.
And he goes so far as to regard the devil as the creator of the world, in which so much misery is created according to his rules.

His friend Herax warns him of such a radical view of the world, and is himself struck dead by nature’s forces.
In Kchatom’s mind’s eye, the devil creates the world, and lays down the laws.

Thereupon, he teaches all those who strive for higher positions in the world to respect his laws in the world, and particularly to apply them in education.

JOURNALIST: In the large-scale ballet in mime, you investigate the fundamental mechanisms of such devilish education, where the individual is forced into a loss of individuality and consumption – into hidden slavery, and you also show, how outsiders are usually dealt with: with those who oppose such educational mechanisms.

PETER HÜBNER: According to these modern ideals of education of individual suppression, the developments of the great spiritual movements of mankind: the religions, are shown in front of Kchatom’s mind’s eye during the action.

During all ages, innovators have been expelled, murdered or declared insane – right up to this very day.^Claudius

JOURNALIST: In your work for the stage “Curse or blessing: Yet” you present the fundamental stages of these developments on stage as the manifestations of Kchatom’s inner ideas and contemplations. And in the end, he finds himself ^Kepler – awak­en­ing from his dreamy thoughts – in to­day’s Chris­tian times, as the eter­nal “de­gen­er­ated” revo­lu­tion­ary.

And hardly has he publicly spoken about his visions of the unethical situation in the world, when he is excluded from church by the Christian institution.

PETER HÜBNER: In our present times, the church cannot simply kill an independently thinking person or chase him away, today it can only denigrate such a person in public, and only run away from him into the shelter of its ecclesiastical buildings and fenced off land holdings.

JOURNALIST: The church’s offering to Kchatom to devoutly join the parish, go to church, and to suffocate his free thoughts in the routine of religious celebrations, are rejected by him.^Schiller

PETER HÜBNER: Yes, he has become aware of and has ex­peri­enced too many things to be able to turn back.^Morgenstern

And so he once again thinks over all his previous experiences right from the beginning – in this case, everything he has experienced on stage as a member of the audience, but what in reality has developed out of his mind’s eye in his own imagination: the creation of the world through the word and the devil’s hand, as well as the observance of his laws through the ambitious leaders of society during the different times, and the application of his laws for the education of new generations: the consistent guide of the entire world to the process of self-destruction, to individual, social and ecological crises which lead plants, animals and humans alike to the edge of an existential abyss.

JOURNALIST: During the new re-capitulation of this whole idea of the world, two great scenes in his life crystallise out of Kchatom’s mind’s eye.
He recognises himself in the role of Sysiphus as he, again and again with the greatest effort, heaves himself up the enormous colossus of his endeavour, the high mountain of evolution, and how all troubles slip from his hands, as he ages, dies and resigns, before he reaches the peak of his human striving – and this again and again.

And he sees himself ^Bohr in the role of Diogenes, as he – beyond all such fruitless efforts – sits in his cave at the foot of the mountain of his evolution which he cannot climb by his own efforts, and does not care at all about these Sysiphus endeavours.^Seneca

PETER HÜBNER: And many of his fellow human beings are also starting to identify themselves and their lives with the unsuccessful acts and/or non-acts of Sysiphus and/or Diogenes, and they tell themselves after two millennia of Christian up­bring­ing: our whole life, too, is similar to the fruitless efforts of Sysiphus.

We start our career in human society with great vigour, but on our way we encounter illness and misfortune quite early on, and in the end we become old, and don’t know where the journey of our life leads us to: we die without knowledge.

And why should we not drop this mad striving for things which have no continued existence, which give us no continued existence either, and, as a hippy or tramp, as a convinced unemployed person, follow in the footsteps of life of that great wise man Diogenes, who keeps seeing the sweaty, groaning Sysiphus arrive in vain at his feet.^Fabiani

Whilst Kchatom’s fellow human beings begin to waver in their religious, dogmatic peacefulness, and by means of the visions of Sysiphus and Diogenes recognise the inadequacy of their previous efforts, Kchatom succeeds in recognising in his inner being, the unity of the two life roles of Sysiphus and Diogenes which seem to be so fundamentally different – which suddenly frees him from all worries in life:^Rousseau he recognises the world as a product of his own free will, and his creative imagination.